April, 2008: Just about anyone who's picked up an instrument of any kind has a musical hero - a personal god or goddess that inspired us to take up music in the first place. Although some of our readers may not be familiar with Bibi Farber or Jim Wilson, you've most likely heard of their friends and colleagues. Besides being the driving force behind L.A.'s MOTHER SUPERIOR band for over a decade, Jim Wilson has recorded extensively with Henry Rollins, Wayne Kramer, Ron & Russell Mael of SPARKS, mega-producer Daniel Lanois, and scores of others. In addition to her two solo records, Bibi has worked with Richard Lloyd of TELEVISION, Pat Dinizio of THE SMITHEREENS, members of SPACE HOG, NADA SURF, THE ROYAL PURPLE, THE IAN HUNTER BAND and many others. Her songs have been featured in a wide variety of TV shows and commercials.

Despite their busy schedules, Bibi and Jim took the time to answer some questions about some of their experiences in working with big-name musicians, and even provide some advice for young bands considering such collaborations.

Marchman: Thanks to both of you for answering a few questions. What are your schedules like these days?

Jim Wilson: It's really been the busiest time for me ever! This year is already fully booked for me. 6 weeks with MOTHER SUPERIOR in Europe in March and April, then 2 months with SPARKS (we've been rehearsing 12-4 every day for this. 21 albums to learn!) and I was just asked to do some touring with Daniel Lanois later this year too!

Bibi Farber: I am finishing three songs with Kevin Salem and two songs with Christian Cassan. I will continue to record songs, and make them available for download -- and who knows, it may turn into a new cd. I am hired to contribute a theme song for a kid's science show, connected to the NPR radio show "Pulse of the Planet". This will be my first "work for hire" job, which means: 1. I forego the royalties and hand over the baby for a lump sum up front 2. I'm actually being offered money for a song that doesn't exist yet! That's never happened before!

Marchman: With all of the great music you've created and well-known musicians you've worked with, I'm amazed that more people aren't familiar with your work.

Jim: I can happily say that I've been lucky enough making a living playing music for 10 years. I just try to keep busy and write good songs! The kind of music we play obviously doesn't fit in any category that's on the charts or on MTV, but that's a good thing because I don't listen to that kind of music anyway. Of course, it would be nice to live like Bono, but I really do feel fortunate to be able to survive in this crazy business. Just knowing that there's anyone out there who's interested in the songs we play is awesome and makes me want to keep getting better.

Marchman: Can you guys remember the first well-known musician or musical hero you worked with, and what the circumstances were?

Bibi: The first one may have been Mark White from the SPIN DOCTORS, the cool bass player. He ended up playing with me because he knew my drummer (and I believe was trying to get to know my drummers female roommate!) Mark was certainly "famous" -- they had sold about 13 million records at that point. I knew the guys in the SPIN DOCTORS through playing at Nightingales, this dive bar that used to be on 2nd Ave, before they broke. Anyway, Richard Lloyd of course, is the first legendary musical giant that I got to work with.

Jim: When MOTHER SUPERIOR first started playing gigs around hollywood, we had some early supporters that included Bruce Gary, the original drummer for THE KNACK. Bruce was a great drummer (all you have to hear is "My Sharona" to know that) and at the time he was working for Alan Douglas who was in charge of the Hendrix catalog. Bruce was mixing those Jimi CDs, so we thought he'd be a good choice to mix our first cd "The Heavy Soul Experience Of Mother Superior". He was awesome and taught us some amazing tricks. We learned a lot about the recording studio from him; he was funny, patient and talented. In 2006, bruce passed away and I still think about him and how he helped us out early on. Around the same time, I was still working at a record store and met Henry Rollins. We played Henry those tracks we were recording with Bruce (whom Henry also knew) and Henry wrote the liner notes for that first CD. That lead to writing, recording and touring with him. R.I.P. Bruce! We love you!!

Marchman: What was it like working with Richard Lloyd, Bibi?

Bibi: The circumstances, in a nutshell, were that I had been a big fan - having attended almost every local show that Richard Lloyd played in NYC since forever, and through me being such an avid supporter, circumstances unfolded so that Richard made a record in Sweden with all my ex-bandmates, ex-boyfriends and dear friends in FIELD OF FIRE. He had given me guitar lessons back in the mid 80s too. So I called him up one day and asked him to produce a 3-song demo. I had no expectations of him playing guitar on it! We ended up working on a whole CD together, he played all the guitar. I put it out myself, and then we played together in his band for another four years. I was on rhythm guitar.

Marchman: What were your first impressions when you met him?

Bibi: I was blown away by how deep and thorough he was! Richard really pays attention. I had never worked with a musician that was so serious and trafficking in excellence at all times. It was like being around a grown up for the first time instead of all these adolescents. He knew what he wanted , knew exactly what he was doing, and didn't waste any time. It made everyone around us sit up a little straighter. They guys in the band started being punctual, played with all they had. Personally, I feel like that was the beginning of having a real mentor and thereby a musical path. Nobody - not a band member, producer or music teacher - ever made me work hard the way he did, and nothing in any area of life has since been that much fun and that inspiring. It continues to be an exhilarating part of my life. I feel the next time I get to play with someone on that level, I am prepared. I developed many good habits that continue to this day. I am very proud to say: this year it is 10 years since I put out the "Firepop" disc. One of the best songs, "Seeds of Anger", was just used by the A&E Network for a Sopranos promo on the website! Another song was used in a Kodak commercial, and almost all of them have been licensed for something.

Marchman: What are some other advantages to playing with seasoned musicians?

Bibi: Well, I do think this comes down to the individual and what kind of artist they are. Are they going to keep experimenting until they get the sound they're looking for, or are they going for the sound they always got in the past? Certainly, seasoned musicians may have more of a comfort zone established and they can go there to access everything that's familiar to them already. I can say that working with Richard Lloyd, he was always searching beyond the boundaries of his comfort zone, partially because he was embracing the new role of producer. All of the elements of the recording were there to be played with and to be playful with - not just his guitar parts. As a producer, he was taking his first forays into new territory, so there was excitement and experimentation and the sense of that we had time to spend to get it right, because we had never done this before. It felt like kids in their first band adventure much of the time to me! We were always trying different approaches to recording drums, vocals, everything. There was a piano part that I wrote and was showing Joe McGinty, the pianist on this session-- and Richard decided he liked the way I played it in the right hand more and the way McGinty played the bass in the left hand! So you actually hear a composite of the two in the track! He had a few tricks up his sleeve like little Supro amps that got that huge sound, doing Nashville tuning on guitars, or running effects in some unexpected way, stuff he had worked with before. He really knows his guitar sounds of course, but if anyone was open to experimentation, and not resting on his laurels, it was this "seasoned musician!"

Marchman: Do you think someone who had been around as long as Lloyd is less open to outside opinions than a younger producer?

Bibi: It would depend on what the outside opinion was! If Butch Vig walked in and suggested a different mike or something, that would have been alright but it probably would have been a disaster if a record label had in the picture for example, because no, Richard wasn't making a "conventional chick pop-rock" mainstream sounding record with polite guitars in the background of the singer, and for that I am still grateful and proud!

Marchman: What kind of advice would you give a young band that recruits a ‘legendary’ musician or producer to work with them on an album. Perhaps they’re expecting instant mega-success from the experience. What can a band really derive from working with a personal hero?

Jim: Well, hopefully the band or artist is able to work with a personal hero or someone they respect and not just someone trying to "produce" them (like a studio owner or some bs'er). We've had plenty of guys that have studios that want to "produce" us and in those situations we let them know that we (the band) is in charge, especially if we're paying them. Some guys like to get crazy in the studio and make the music into something it's not, so just be aware of that. Once in the early days, we recorded a song and the studio engineer wanted to slow down my vocal recording so it would sound more like the RIGHTEOUS BROTHERS. I mean, I love the RIGHTEOUS BROTHERS, but I don't want to sound like them. Again, write good songs first before you go into the studio and practice up the band too. That's the band's job.

Bibi: It all comes down to what they have to offer to begin with. Hopefully, and this was my experience, the big name is a great source of inspiration and creativity. Your project takes on a heightened focus and a lot of energy gathers around it. New fans arrive out of thin air because you're working with this person, and all kinds of doors swing open (more true for big name artists/ musicians than producers). For me, it was the greatest thing that ever happened. But sometimes a big name can overshadow, or the band can default too much to the 'legendary' person and just want to cover up their weak points with reflected glory. Sometimes people will think the big name person is a distraction. It can be a double-edged sword marketing-wise. For example, if Eric Clapton were featured on every track of some unknown artist's debut, it could easily overshadow their own work, no matter how talented and unique this new artist was, many people would be listening for Clapton only. I know some people felt that way about my CD, but I embrace every track just the way it is anyway! And it brought plenty of new fans! There is a lot of Richard Lloyd on there. He even said : "You wanted a new record out of me so bad you made one yourself!" which is really true. I would give a band working with a personal hero the following advice: enjoy it! Learn all you can! Really open up to this person's artistic wavelength, he or she might come asking for your musicality or songwriting one day. And hold your own!

Bibi: I agree with Jim about all of this! nail down the particulars: points if there are any for producers (that is a type of royalty, or extra payment from the artist or label, based on sales), discuss the credit as it will read on the artwork of the CD, and are they being paid by the song? By the hour? When the project is done for the whole thing? As far as the feasibility, whether or not a "name" person can make time for your project is very much about what else they have going on. If you get them between projects they'll be much more available, approachable, willing to work on spec maybe or below the rate they would charge a "label" project. More than once I have gotten through to people I've wanted to work with, once they "settle down" and have kids! Then they want to earn some money, they often want their career to be more about recording, and they badly want to get out of the house, but not out of town! So that can be a great time-- before the kids are up and running!

Marchman: That's a great point. It's different than any other profession in that regard!

Bibi: Case in point: I wanted to work with Kevin Salem (genius producer and guitarist) many years ago and we met in Brooklyn at his place. I don't even remember the situation, but he was too busy I think. The schedules didn't match up. I had really wanted to work with him, but 5 years later he had a 4-year-old and can work at home in his studio every day ! We are just now finishing three of my songs. My circumstances were as follows with Richard Lloyd: He was between tours with Matthew Sweet, and his son was maybe 4. So the idea of a project in town appealed to him. I called him up, he came to a gig, and liked the demo I handed him that night. He called a few days later and agreed to do some demos. But we kept on recording more and the "demos" turned into a real 11 song CD - "Firepop"! I approached Richard knowing he had produced a local unknown band, so I knew this wasn't too far-fetched.

Marchman: Plus, you already knew him from guitar lessons in the 80s.

Bibi: Right. If he were someone I didn't know-- at this point I would say I would just try. Find out what they would charge and if there's any chance -- you never know! They might be available in 5 years? Regardless they'll be flattered you approached them. And as you make these connections they always lead to other things. Maybe the person will say no, but you end up seeing each other again. Maybe you open for their band or whatever - they remember you and some kind of goodwill is set in motion. It's really good for you on all levels to reach for what you want, because you want to keep going in that direction, working with inspiring people, surrounding yourself with a standard of excellence, no matter who says yes or no at this juncture.

Marchman: Is there anyone on your list that you're currently working on, Bibi?

Bibi: Someone I still badly want to work with is Jason Falkner. I have tried! This is a case of just starting from scratch. I had no connection to him. First of all, he is in LA I'm in NY so right away it is a bit of a stretch. Anyway, I found out who managed him, sent an actual letter with my CD, asked if Jason produced other artists. He said yes, he would put me in touch. So Jason Falkner called me up one beautiful day and we had a nice chat and he liked what I had done with Richard - it wasn't completely outrageous, my idea that we work together. But he was going on the road with AIR, and that took years. Then he recorded with Paul McCartney of all people ( and played bass on 2 tracks!) Now, well, I still have hope! Someone let me know when Jason Falkner has a toddler at home please! Seriously though, my overall feeling is that if it is too expensive or complicated or too much of sacrifice on some level, for the band or individual to hire a "name" it is probably not going to be a comfortable fit. I have overpaid "name" people and it really wasn't worth it. It's worth it when there is a vibe and something takes shape and it feels "destined to be". If that part feels right, usually the money part will fit into place, it won't be the primary thing the relationship centers around. Also, if you for any reason are not ready to record- the songs or the band aren't there yet. The famous person will be a waste of energy and will not be able to save a project that is not strong to begin with. So, in summary, approach them professionally and respectfully when you are ready. Start with a smaller scope - one, two or three songs. and take it from there if it's working for you!

Bibi Farber's solo discs "Firepop" and "Second Kiss" are both available through CDBaby or her website, www.bibifarber.com. MOTHER SUPERIOR's latest CD "Grande" is available through Kicking Records. Find out more about them at www.mother-superior.com.

**The web version of this article can be found at www.peacedogman.com/gtrghero**